QB64 Delenda Est!

[Pete]

Hey Spriggsy,

Who's Samuel? These here forums ain't dern near big enough fur 2 Sams!

Edit: Ooh, I gotta makes me a guess. Iz it: a740g?

- Sam

[mnrvovrfc]

:
In the end, this is what my hard drive looks like.


This. Is. Wrong.
I should have ONE folder.

Users could have choice? Anybody could fork the source code if he/she is knowledgeable and persistent enough? One folder sounds like a dictatorship. I'm on the side of Phoenix Edition but I'm sort of glad there is "competition" in which we could compliment each other. As for developers not getting along, that's everywhere.

Just use one or the other, or both. If you use both, you could help both sides squash the annoying bugs, the inconsistencies with operation from an executable program created by the programming system.

You could also be one of those users having 32-bit and 64-bit Windows versions of QB64PE and/or the "official" QB64. I don't know what that is. Having two folders in your case is even more of a blessing, except it wastes disk space with their own kits of MinGW.

This is like choosing Windows, or choosing Linux. Only because Linux offers multiple desktop environments and there are at least 50 different intepretations of it, some people get put off and accept a single choice of payware that, admittedly, has been quite good despite its many flaws and the creator's attempts to make its users worship it. So I'm glad QB64PE (and the other programming system) could work on Windows, MacOS and Linux. It will never be perfect. Even if the programmers of one side or another got along, it would never be perfect, but we (the combined community, at least both forums) could try to be.

[Dimster]

Hello bearheathen. Lot of cancer and cancer scares running in my family circle as well. Such hopeful news that your wife has fought it and won.

I'm not sure this split between the QB64 factions isn't a good thing. Especially when you consider that Basic has been around a very long time and different versions that are still out there for programmers/coders to adapt and try. It's like the growth of a tree and it's multiple branches. As they say "Time heals all wounds" the key being TIME. My vote though would be to hope both versions continue on a path of discovery and change.

[DSMan195276]

And that's the saddest part. I see the value of BOTH. I see advantage in being able to reach the Old School and New audiences. I myself fall somewhere in the middle. I daresay this may well apply to a large portion of potential users. 

Restore the wiki...AND have it available in Github Markdown. Is it extra work? Sure, but there are adherents of both philosophies who are clearly willing to make the effort and the information is made more widely available. That is an advantage, I would say.

And one of the nice things about this hobby/profession/craft is its flexibility. It is entirely possible to have a fully modernized repo with full CI and automation...while also having a simple ZIP hosted on a page. Again...you merely cater to the widest possible audience when MORE choice is offered.

First, I will point out that PE does have a modernized repo with a CI process that runs tests on every build and PR, and automation to create releases and CI builds. We also have a growing test suite, a new build system that has allowed us to greatly improve the quality of the new code we've added/replaced and start on cleaning up the existing code, and many other things that you can see on our GitHub.

As for GitHub markdown, I've played with it and even built a process to directly pull the contents of the qb64phoenix.com wiki into GitHub. Unfortunately the result is just not good. The issue is less "why not duplicate it" and more "why create a duplicate which is just inferior to the real one and requires an extra automated process, which can break, to keep it up-to-date?". As a back-up it's fine, but frankly as a primary source for people to use it's not great for a wiki as large as QB64s. I'm not saying MediaWiki is the best, but I haven't yet seen someone propose something that's actually better (and worth our limited time to look into).

There has GOT to be a way to fix it. As a technician and developer, I firmly believe that nothing is so broken that it cannot be fixed. What would it take to bring the geniuses on both sides back to the same table?

I get that, it does suck for someone who just wants to use QB64. But then, why should I, someone who's been working hard on PE (along with many others) to turn in into something much better than before, basically throw that all away just to meet Cory's list of nebulous demands and start developing his version in the way he wants with only the changes he wants? A list, I might add, that includes many of the things _we've already done_ in PE and he has ignored.

[mnrvovrfc]

I got the gist of the basic story from the Lunduke article (after I was scratching my head trying to find QB64 and why it had a phoenix on it here, but the one over there didn't, etc. - which is a problem for anyone coming in).

Full transparency: I am speaking to folks on the "Official" side too. 

What I am hearing is there is plenty of bad blood to go around. I am listening to both sides, and both have grievances. That is the nature of conflict. 

The link navigates to a story which is an opinion that perhaps wanted to focus on Galleon, the creator of QB64. Not as much about which side was right this spring this year. Controversy was caused... but it's best to talk about it the least possible. It's difficult to obtain "full transparency" because of something you said in your first post on this forum. Do you want "full transparency"? You have to involve as many people as possible involved in the "dot-rip" or whatever it was called before the split.

Some people are worried about the next time they could log into this forum, after what happened in mid-April. They don't want conflicts and they don't care any longer which side was right. At least I speak for myself, I want to continue doing my own thing without hassle. I spread word about QB64 Phoenix Edition in a few places because it's the choice I made, but it's only a choice. It's not a conflict.

@DSMan195276 sorry about the ninja, was going to add to my previous post. :/

[Kernelpanic]

The usual! A few enthusiasts get together to start a good project, then there are differences, jealousies, some lack more appreciation, plus a shot of craving for recognition, and finally the whole thing implodes.

Luckily there were people here who continued the project QuickBasic -> QB64Phoenix. Bringing them back together with those primarily responsible for the implosions is useless. It would only bring new unrest into the project. Der Drops ist gelutscht! (Translated: The drop is sucked! Better: The matter is decided!)

When I see here what one can program with this modern Basic, that can partly be compared with VisualBasic, then this programming language is not from yesterday. On the contrary, it has potential. Just it needs to get rid of that outdated image.

[Kernelpanic]

Who's Samuel? These here forums ain't dern near big enough fur 2 Sams!

That's it: There can only be one Princess! 

[bplus]

@Spriggsy Is dualbrain amongst that group you mentioned. Not hanging out at Discord much I don't know Matt, Samuel,... is Matt the DS#### guy? Dualbrain seems pretty cool as far as I can tell... maybe naming names best for PM (Personal Messages)?

[DSMan195276]

@Spriggsy Is dualbrain amongst that group you mentioned. Not hanging out at Discord much I don't know Matt, Samuel,... is Matt the DS#### guy? Dualbrain seems pretty cool as far as I can tell... maybe naming names best for PM (Personal Messages)?

To clarify, yes I'm Matt, Cory is DualBrain.

[mnrvovrfc]

Never mind, got confused by how the post was written. Sorry about that.